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  1. #1

    Some Questions (and much nostalgia)

    Hi All

    I'm sure there have been similar posts to this over the last few years, but I'll do it anyway.

    From 2001 (Stalingrad demo?) to 2004/5, this game was as much my life as work and spending time with my then-gf, and certainly the most enjoyable of them all. (BTW I'm now happily married with a daughter). I wasn't a big PC gamer at the time, and somewhat fell into it playing a perhaps little-known game called Midtown Madness 2. After having joined an online team on that game, I came across some fellow players whom 20yrs later I still call my friends and still regularly speak to. Eventually, we progressed from Operation: Flashpoint to the MOH Stalingrad demo to the full game on release, and the next few years were some of the best I'd known. I would be proud of my scores and take screenshots (I found them recently, I've attached a few) and I loved the sniper rifle but never sat and camped. Shoot and move was the key for me. I recall well watching Band Of Brothers on a Friday night, and then logging onto my "fast" ISDN and seeing all my mates online on MSN (oh I miss those days) and playing until 2-3am through GameVoice. We'd be in tourneys, have theme nights in our server like 0 gravity, freeze-tag and other server mods, as well as have custom sound patches so that everyone sounded like Monty Python. Sounds sad now, but back then it was comedy gold!

    I was in 3 clans that I co-owned: =75-D=, =975th= and =Vfor= - the latter kept going until around 2008 even once I'd left - with our own BarrysWorld servers, forums and website. I love those days.

    Anyway, flash forward nearly 20yrs (and a little cry) and here I am now, with MOHAA installed on an XP VM through my Mac, having dragged out my old right-handed MS trackball just for the purpose. I must confess, I still love it. It's great to see people still playing this, and I'm so glad that someone took over after Gamespy stopped and kept the game going. I do have some questions, though...

    1) How easy is it to mod and hack this game now? What RCON software is now in place to help prevent and detect these mods, should they exist? I say this because I have been headshotted by a BAR farrrrrrr more regularly now than I ever did back then.
    2) Does lag cause even more of an issue now than then? Endless shots of mine that I thought were bang on did nothing, yet my ping was < 50
    3) Are there any of the old clans still knocking around? I don't remember their names now, but it would good to know some have kept playing all these years
    4) Why do so few servers seem to have TDM running? I love obj but most servers seem to have far too many rounds per map, and I never like FFA.

    Well, that was my two pence. If anyone is on here who used to be in any of my clans back then, or just recognises the name perhaps and wants to say hello, please do so. Even though I haven't had much luck since playing again so far, it's been great. The tricks never leave you...how I'd run along the staircase rails in Stalingrad rather than use the steps, or just down one balcony level to the other to avoid people waiting on them, sitting in certain positions in v2 so you could see all the doors at once, lobbing grenades from a certain point on the Hunt on the Axis side to try and splatter Allied players running down the street, binding lean and turn to look ridiculous but gain an advantage everyone else used round corners. This was an ace game that I'll always love. Thanks to everyone who's kept it alive.

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    Last edited by =Vfor= Valleyman; 02-09-2021 at 10:24 PM.

  2. #2
    I must admit, I did think I might get at least one reply. I've been quite disheartened as there doesn't seem to be anywhere these days where people who played MOH (and now do again) come together and discuss memories from those times. (I'm aware that sounds like I'm an old army vet or something).

    What I've noticed:

    • Virtually NO servers in the UK just play standard TDM on default maps
    • There seems to be a ridiculous number of people with suspiciously fabulous skills (I say this as someone who wasn't too shabby either), yet servers all go on about having anti-cheat software on
    • WOV clan seems to be a friendly group
    • You can rent your own server for less than 30 a month (and it's tempting, just so I can play TDM again)

    I'd love to get a conversation going about all this stuff. Someone reply....PLEASE?!

  3. #3
    Administrator Major_A's Avatar
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    Normally I catch new posts, but the last few days just jumped in and say hey and didn't really look. I even missed Soares93's post on the new rifle he's working on lol

    As far as your questions go though, lets establish a base referance to modding and rcon as per your first question.

    1) How easy is it to mod and hack this game now? What RCON software is now in place to help prevent and detect these mods, should they exist?

    There are different types of modding, the first being something you have done that everyone can see "a server mod" done serverside, clients need no download.

    Server/client mods are basically something cool visually or audibly, but not nessasary for people to have the client to play, but gives no advantage to players who can't see or hear something.

    A client mod can be something as simple as a cool healthpack mod or compass or a cusom server connect menu as like in my first post here: For Spearhead

    A BASIC hack client side mod is normally considered a bright player skin and then you set your skin models to Force skin.
    Can it give an advantage, yes, but...people that have been playing for so long now most people have skin or mappacks that have things in them, depending on the skin name, and depending on the rcon will constantly kick that player and if that player is a regular and generally on the up and up, banned skins are generally turned off so it's not irritating.

    A downright dirty unfair thing to do client side mod, is modify your pk3 files to turn off your trees or change your walls to glass texture or something.
    You can catch people that do this on purpose if you follow them in spectate long enough.
    There have been times over the year a few guys have found a cool mod, but didn't realize bushes are gone or some garbage like that, but it had a compass they liked.
    That's usually when someone can fix it so it just shows the compass, no big deal.

    If your getting headshot all the time, USUALLY I believe, the server could have bullet damage and range set higher to play faster. If there is another reason, I'm unsure atm,
    but there may be an external program at work here like aimbot your thinking, but unsure still as I've never had the chance to play with one so I couldn't really tell you how they work.

    As far as Rcon goes, I'm not really sure what moh guys are using, but in Spearhead I've always used Forsight, I think the moh guys use it too, but I have no idea if anyone has reverse engineered it or otherwise made other modifications to the server monitor. The original program was lost in a fire if I recall correctly, so original code was lost.

    I have added a great deal of functions to the client menu over the years to do more things, but the server monitor itself had a few bugs.

    I haven't loaded moh for awhile, but when I did, I went to MAW clan server and chated with Doublekill, BobUK and those guys, but they generally played TDM.
    In the US, alot of our servers are TDM, but with TWZ we usually run TDM and then FFA on Saturdays but the server is generally set up for fast paced playing with things like proxy mines and full auto silenced pistols.

    When I still had my server, our ICCC group would play in different server setups on different nights. It was fun to have something differnt on different nights with custom maps.

    The link will take you to the full video description.


    I lost the ability to have acces to my free online server about 6 months ago, so until
    I can figure out something else, I myself have slowed way down in the custom modding dept and I've also switched to linux way before that and the map sdk doesn't function like it did in windows which really sucks and have really found it hard to try and sort it out with real life stuff going on. The game runs great through WINE but as I said with the Spearhead sdk, it complains alot.

    As far as other hacks go, nowadays there are generally either an outside program running or a modified other game file able to see through walls or whatever.
    At this point, this is where the guys over at X-Null come in.

    They have been working on moh upgrades to deal with such things, but they have not reached Spearhead or Breakthrough yet to my knowledge.
    Last edited by Major_A; 02-13-2021 at 12:36 AM.

  4. #4
    Wow yourself! That was some reply, thank you very much.

    Re question 1 - I remember using custom .pk3 files for things like the Monty Python sounds, and yes for things like the sniper scope or a compass. My question was mainly around the question of people using hacks to improve their aim in other ways, like aimbots. I did not know that you could edit the server configs to effectively increase damage, or that people could alter their .pk3s to remove trees or make walls like glass etc. What really is the point in stuff like that? Where's the fun? I don't know why people would want to increase damage on their servers, as it just means people think someone's cheating, and / or get fed up and leave their server. A headshot is a headshot, but not one in the arm from 200ft away. Like you, I've never installed (or looked for, tbh) one so I don't know exactly how they work.

    I wish I had known about the custom menu connect mod. All I had really, though I still liked it, was a shortcut on my desktop that took me straight to the server with RCON access. It did the job for me, but this is cool too. How much visibility do MOH servers have of such modifications - is it all from within the .pk3 and .cfg files, or does it somehow have access to the file structure of the MOH game directories?

    I've watched the video but I'm not really sure what I'm looking at. I like the LCARS stuff, btw. The quality is a bit low so I can't make out much of the text. I'd be interested in seeing a higher quality copy?

    Thanks for your reply mate, it's clear you still have a lot of time and energy for MOH and I'm glad that is the case. I'm trying to get some of my old clan mates together to do a nostalgia night and play again. I've played many FPS since these good old days, and they're fantastic. But there's something about Stalingrad, Destroyed Village and Southern France (not to mention the tactics on The Hunt and V2....and SNOWY PARK!!!) that Battlefield just can't recreate. I remember a modern MOH game did have some recreations of a couple of these old maps, but it wasn't the same because the engine wasn't the same...so it didn't feel the same. The theme tune I could listen to allllll day - no game of this type has ever matched that soundtrack, for me. Yes there are flaws in this game, and they were noticeable even then, but that only adds to the experience.


  5. #5
    Administrator Major_A's Avatar
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    I think aimbots use an external program of some kind that would be the only thing I can think of that would work idk.

    Over the years of playing so long, some players like faster paced gameplay like one shot one kill type of thing. In my case, I had serverside mods that could increase your health so that it's unexpected when someone hits you, you still get a bit of a chance to get away.
    I like the unexpected twists you can add to the game to give it that "Well that's new lol" type of feeling. That was the idea of the Akmed suicide bomber vest available on some of my maps...It made people think twice about sneaking up on you and bashing you :P

    It's mostly about doing that bit of different thing so finding a server or multiple ones with different gameplay so you have something different to do. There are still stock Spearhead servers in the US, but when I play, me personally, stock settings and weapons drive me crazy as I like to play for fun and don't care if I die or not but there are rare occasions when I go to other servers I actually try, but honestly spent so much time modding or something Im nowhere good as I used to be.
    If I go to a UK server like MAW clan or something I have to take into account lag as my ping jumps from 50 to around 125 so leading your target gets more important.
    If your getting hit across the map, most likely the bullet range was increased on the server and if your poking your head around an object, thats all thats visible, so your more likely to get hit in the head.

    It's funny you mentioned a higher quality version of that video because I went looking through my backups for the source but I think I lost it. Not sure it would have mattered though as I did those particular one shortly after I switched to linux and hadn't learned how to use OBS studio all that great yet so it was recording at a lower resolution and I didn't even notice, it was probly a video lag thing, so I probly did set it lower.
    Just last week however, I went from 12GB of ram to 32GB so next time I use OBS and the game simultaneously, I may be able to fix that.

    What your looking at in that video was weeks of playing around and adding NEW added weapons into the game. I started with the Crossbow and Uzi.
    These are added weapons along side what you get with the game. I was rebuilding these from another server I used to play on, but his house was broke into and his computer stolen, so the only surviving parts of his server mod was the client weapons, so I had to try and rebuild what he did serverside of things.
    Right before I made the switch to linux, I made this higher res test recording.

    Thing is, even in windows, I could never figure out why recorders would not pic up my mic, so people your hearing are everyone but me.
    But here is a higher res video to see things better what the Crossbow and Uzi look like.

    Here is a link to the full description of what I'm working on.

    I did play with another screen recorder though and it starts from my linux desktop so you can see some of the stuff I've done to my menu.
    Your desktop icon that took you to a server works pretty much the same way.
    This is just a little fancier and good learning experience in learning how the game file system works, which is basically alphabetical, which is
    why you want mods to start with a "z" so the game loads altered files overriding stock files.

    You only need the first 30 seconds of the video to see that, so no need to watch the whole thing lol

    Theres a number of videos on my page of game play, but hoping to get something setup someplace so I can
    continue modding as there are alot more guns to add other than the crossbow and uzi.
    I do get what you mean about the nostalgic part though. It's just that in my case I've spent so many years making my
    server the way I wanted it, especially around Christmas when I turned on all the Christmas stuff in the maps.

    Are you using your original disks, or have you downloaded the updated MOH-Revival version with all the fixes in it like server browser and widescreen fix?

  6. #6
    I do have the original disks for AA and SH, and possibly the others for the 10th anniversary edition (or whatever it was), though at the moment I can't find the latter...but it's somewhere. For this exercise, I have the downloaded Revival edition with the widescreen settings etc. I can't remember how large the TFT screen I had at the time was in 2002, maybe 19inch? It's certainly different seeing it across a widescreen 32inch display (pic attached), and still being able to use my other (Mac) screen to look at the web or use iMessage etc. Back then, it was a case of you wanna get into MSN or add someone else to GameVoice, you had to minimise that whole thing down and risk getting killed lol.

    I'm afraid most of what you say, whilst I understand the theory, is over my head as at the time I think the most I had was a variation on the Kar98 scope. Is there a pk3 mod you can get that only makes the crosshairs a bit easier to see? On a 32inch widescreen, it can get a bit lost when moving about...

    I get your meaning about wanting to mix things up, which is why we'd do anti-gravity night, I think we even had multiple servers at one point. With how it is now, what I'm yearning for are servers full of people (which will never happen now, sad though it may be), and having the opportunity to play some standard TDM if I want to. Everything in UK / Europe seems to be either FFA, obj or stuff like Freeze Tag which I never got into. I'd even settle for a bit of Sniper Valley, but nobody seems to run that map.

    One good thing though, is that I've been talking to some of my ex clan pals, and there's a good bit of interest in firing up the game again on their machines, and having a bit of a reunion...even the possibility of getting our own server for the occasion...and it's cheap enough to rent one in my eye and just have it there for when I'd like to use it. After all, I believe late 2001 is when the Stalingrad demo first appeared and so is coming up for 20yrs since most of us all started playing.
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  7. #7
    Administrator Major_A's Avatar
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    OK glad you have revival. ver 2 is the latest and can see that your buddies get it.

    on the crosshair thing, years back I made a menu with 42 crosshairs in it.
    you can change it on the fly just by clicking. The link is here

    Since then, I have upgraded it to work in my rcon menu

    As the link states, doesn't work right in AA only SH
    You know, I was assuming you play AA but really not sure lol

    If your using SH those will work. If you want my rcon menu for SH let me know as it will work with forsight,
    it also can do things for you with the need of rcon like changing crosshairs and a couple other things, but it will work for any
    server running forsight as long as you have the password.

    if your using AA you can try to get raptor menu to work or at the top of this site, the database menu it where all kinds of things are as an example
    here is the search link, just type in crosshair in the search title

    There is not alot of crosshairs in the database but once you open a single pk3 with pakscape or winzip you can see how the mod is made
    then get my raptor menu and you can pull out individual ones...that is if your using AA.
    If your using SH then the menu will work and don't worry about what I just said.

    Have you tried Discord yet or are you going to use Teamspeak?
    I ask this because at 8:00pm eastern tonight we will be TWZ and tonight is FFA night no need to download anything "maps"
    but here is a discord invite if you want to try it out. Nights are Teusday Thurshday Sat & Sunday 8-10

    We only use our teamspeak for emergencies anymore.

    These will be modded stock maps I used on my server....sooooo, lots of places to go you normally couldn't before lol
    the game server ip is
    This is our Spearhead server so if you want to try it out feel free.

    Also here is the website for game nights and whatever maps are going on that night.

    You'll notice the latest post tells whats what for tonight.

    If you you do try it out, there are a couple UK guys that do pop in here and there, but if you like to run and gun and hunt people down,
    consider this type of server overkill practice for a stock server !!!!
    You'll learn very quickly to watch your back LMAO

    Also if you don't have revival version 2 installed yet, this may come in handy until you do
    Last edited by Major_A; 02-14-2021 at 01:58 AM.

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